Police Federation and Injury Retirements.

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Police Federation and Injury Retirements.

Post by Mercury on Tue Feb 03, 2015 10:16 am

Because HOC46/2004 only affected IOD's at CRA and SRA, the great majority of those involved were aged 60 and over. Support from the federation has apparently been very patchy with Narpo contributing very little, if anything, to the defence of our IOD pensions.

Now Forces are looking at the IOD pensions of those IOD's who have had to retire and are below CRA. Others who have been injured appear to be having difficulty actually getting IOD awards in the first place. Does anyone know if the Federation are supporting our colleagues in these situations and also, does the Federation have a coherent policy for the support of those retired or facing retirement because of injury on duty?

Mercury

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Re: Police Federation and Injury Retirements.

Post by Adversity on Tue Feb 03, 2015 1:20 pm

I can only speak for my force's federation, who have nothing at all to do with you once you are retired on ill health/injury. They do not even know who the force pension administrator is, (I know others may say you can look at the Narpo site and Gov.uk sites to find out, I did last year, and those details were out of date!)

I had no input from them throughout my process of being retired on an injury pension 15 years ago. I did use the federation solicitor for the MIB case, which commenced before I was retired, but only because I had paid subs for legal expenses.

Only contact I had from NARPO was a leaflet asking me to sign up so I could enjoy their social life and discounted holidays-not a lot of good for me who struggles to leave my house because of my illness.

It is a sad situation to see that the only support you will get is from this site-when you consider you haven't had to pay the administrators of this site hundreds of pounds in subs, they do not sit in swanky offices, or enjoy lavish holidays away under the pretense of it being a 'conference', they do not have an income and 'expenses budget'. They are just the most kind hearted people who have dealt with their anger and frustration of the 'system', by turning their negative experiences into something positive for others. They support you quietly and efficiently, (you might not realise how much they do do, as a lot of communications go on behind the scenes of the forum).

Adversity

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Re: Police Federation and Injury Retirements.

Post by tony laud on Tue Feb 03, 2015 1:22 pm

I can only speak for Cambs but I am currently employed by the local Federation to assist both officers and pensioners with all pension matters including reviews. I retired from the Fed in 2012 and began the new post immediately. At that point Cambs were still trying to review nearly 200 pensioners and it had become very hostile. Since then we have a new policy that sits outside Regs but means that number has dropped considerably and I would guess is less than 50, it has also ended the  potential constant reviewing for life that exists within Regs. I am currently assisting 3 retired officers with PMAB appeals connected to Band reductions. Where I have asked for legal advise or assistance from the national Fed it has been granted. I do not always ask as most of the cases revolve around Laws and Turner so the grounds of appeal are similar. I do though know that some Federations have never been interested in HOC 46/2004 and continue to offer little or no support.

tony laud

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Fed +NARPO

Post by Kaine448 on Tue Feb 03, 2015 8:15 pm

Hi Mercury,
I sympathise with your predicament.Like Tony above I am or was in a rural eastern force(enough info already!) but I must say that the fed were excellent and the guy who managed my case did so very professionally and achieved a good result,perhaps it is a case of finding the right person in the department to represent you.I have yet to need the services of NARPO but I think from previous messages by Bearpit on the old forum they have a grip on the current trends,Good luck to you and all IODs

Kaine448

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Re: Police Federation and Injury Retirements.

Post by Urtica on Fri Mar 06, 2015 8:42 am

Hi Tony,

You say that the Cambs policy 'sits outside Regs'. Can you please explain what you mean? Is the policy considered to advise unlawful actions? In what way is it outside the Regulations?

Urtica

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Re: Police Federation and Injury Retirements.

Post by Roger Melly on Sun Mar 08, 2015 11:33 am

Once again I can only speak for myself. I was given the full support of the federation during my retirement and pmab hearing which included national funding for legal representation. The level of service I received totally transformed my perception of the federation both locally (Cleveland) and nationally.

Roger Melly

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Re: Police Federation and Injury Retirements.

Post by Urtica on Sun Mar 08, 2015 12:46 pm

Tony Laud has been a great support to IOD pensioners in Cambridgeshire. He has done a remarkable job in recent years, dealing with the fall out of the unlawful policy implemented by the now retired at the tender age of 54 and not at all missed CC Julie Spence. Tony has helped many individuals cope with pensio problems and has supported them through difficult times.

Unfortunately, in other areas serving and retired officers have found their local Federation reps to be woefully lacking in knowledge and willinglness to help.

Nationally, the Federation is ready to provide the funding for legal challenges where the case warrants it. Without that funding we would not have seen the breakthrough cases on injury pensions which led to the remarkable victory of seeing the Home Office guidance contained in Annex C to circular 46/2004 being declared unlawful in major part, leading to its total withdrawal.


Last edited by Urtica on Tue Mar 10, 2015 3:57 pm; edited 1 time in total

Urtica

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Re: Police Federation and Injury Retirements.

Post by tony laud on Tue Mar 10, 2015 1:10 pm

Reply to Urtica from the 6th March the policy sits outside Regs as it stops the constant reviewing of pensioners once they have had three with no changes. The person can still request a review and the Force will arrange one but I can't think many will want to go through the process. This has meant about 150 plus are no longer being reviewed. Those that remain are becoming ever fewer with only 2 due next year. Also all references to CRA and state retirement gone

tony laud

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Re: Police Federation and Injury Retirements.

Post by Urtica on Tue Mar 10, 2015 4:13 pm

Thanks Tony, but I have to comment that the police pension authority (PPA) has always had a wide power of discretion granted under the Regulations as to whether or when to conduct a review. That discretion extends to deciding not to review. It all hinges on whether or not a suitable interval can be identified. The power of discretion is entirely dependent, conditional, on the PPA positively identifying that a suitable interval has passed.

The actual wording is that the PPA,' . . . shall at such intervals as may be suitable, consider whether the degree of the pensioner’s disablement has altered . . .'

I believe the PPA has determined that, in the instances you highlight, a suitable interval has been identified - and that it is open ended. In other words, the policy accepts that, as a general principle, once degree of disablement appears to be stable and unlikely to alter substantially then there is no reason to consider the matter again.

The policy puts the onus on pensioners to request a review, and, as you so rightly observe, the majority will not want to. The exceptions will be those who are on lower bands who have experienced a substantial worsening of the disabling effects of the duty injury.

I trust the Federation and NARPO will do their bit to ensure that IOD pensioners are reminded, from time to time, that they can ask for a review if the disablement gets worse.

Urtica

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Re: Police Federation and Injury Retirements.

Post by tony laud on Tue Mar 10, 2015 4:40 pm

I have no doubt that the Force are trying a different approach to reduce the bill, get a tame SMP suggest to him roles that pay well and he does the rest.

The roles being suggested are in my view beyong the officers eductional or career qualifications. Always well paid so result in a reduction in Bands. The SMP also misdirects himself as he completely ignores whether there has been a substantial change to the persons medical condition and carries out a potential earnings reassessment.
The difficulty though will lay with a couple of cases as medically we may have problems showing no change. Also thankfully causation cannot be reopened as one would in my view be a struggle.

tony laud

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Re: Police Federation and Injury Retirements.

Post by RedDog on Wed Mar 11, 2015 8:38 pm

tony laud wrote:Reply to Urtica from the 6th March the policy sits outside Regs as it stops the constant reviewing of pensioners once they have had three with no changes.

Well, I hope the Met use this policy of not pursuing pensioners after three no change reviews. It would be helpful if they'd write to you and inform you as much.

After my last review the SMP recommended that I wasn't reviewed again but the letter from the Police said " Although the SMP recommends not to review you further the Police Authority retains the right to review when they deem necessary"


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