ABSOLUTELY NOTHING FOR BEING DEAF

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ABSOLUTELY NOTHING FOR BEING DEAF

Post by Mollydog on Mon Dec 14, 2015 4:55 pm

I joined Notts Combined Constabulary (later to become Notts Police) in 1970, had various positions. Traffic, Driving School Instructor, Force Control Room Operator and last Divisonal Control Room in 1986.  Over my whole period of service I had no problem with my hearing until in 1993 I had to wear a Radio Headset in the Control Room.  From first putting it on, I would occasionally swap ears to listen but never had any trouble hearing. In 1995, the force started implementing Hearing tests, (with the statement "You won't lose your job for this test"). After my first test, I was told my right ear was low on hearing but carry on with my job. This test was done by the Force Police Surgeons wife, who had no qualifactions to carry out such a test. In 1996, I saw the Police Surgeon who also said I had a low hearing problem with my right ear, but I went back to carrry on in the Control Room. In 1997, the test was done again, again by the PCS's wife who againconfirmed my low right ear result. In November following,I was sent to see a Hearing Sprecialist in Nottingham who confirmed my low hearring in  mainly my right ear and a little in my left. Back at Division, I was taken off radio and put doing Admin until January 1998 when I was told I was to resume normal duties back on radio but may have to see a Sprecialist. I said I had already seen a specialist. The force hadn't been informed of this and the Pol.Surgeon was contacted who confirmed after trying to find the file. Within a week, I was told I was being forced to resign with Injury on Duty, Hearing Loss. The Police Surgeon had signed his cerrtificate (stating he had seen me in 1997 which he hadn't) and made me lose my job. I didn't want this, but was told that was the final result.  I asked to see the Surgeon, but we refused.  I left in March 1998 with a Police Pension but according to the Pol.Surgeon, hearing loss does not qualify for IOD payment, hence I received no percentage or payment. I challenged the decision, received a Home Office ruling from their Medical Surgeon that the Hearing loss was caused by Noise constantly in my ears, but no fault of the Police.  My previous employment was as a Royal Marine where I shot Rifles, always wearing ear defenders (28 yrs previously). this I was told was the cause. There was NO APPEAL to the Home Office decision.

I then contacted the Force Federation who put me in touch with a Solicitor in Birmingham. He basically had me subjected  an MRI Scan, I saw a Hearing Specialist who confirmed noise was my hearing loss, took a statement from me and sent me to see a Barrister in Birmingham who read the report and refused to take to court action as the Solicitor had not done a good enough job, there was nothing in the file to accuse the Police of, he never spoke to anyone where I worked, examined the headsets etc etc. If I had put a file in like that, I'd have been seen by the boss.

So thats where I stand, I still have the full file, all certificates and to date no IOD payout, just my Police Pension. It is almost 18 years since I retired,I am now 67 years old, wear a Hearing Aid in  my Left ear (the right would be no use) and wonder if I could have done more.

Mollydog

Posts : 1
Join date : 2015-12-12
Age : 68
Location : Old Church Warsop, Notts

http://pointon138@gmail.com

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Re: ABSOLUTELY NOTHING FOR BEING DEAF

Post by RedDog on Thu Dec 17, 2015 8:40 pm

Mollydog, unfortunately it all boils down to whether you have written evidence that links your deafness to working in the control room. As a layman I cannot see how firing rifles 28 years earlier can be the result of your deafness. Using firearms and stun grenades even with hearing protection can result in deafness as the growing amount of IOD claims in Northern Ireland can attest to. However, it's usually of a more recent practice.

Although the authorities obviously try to contest this.

I am unable to offer you any useful advice I'm afraid. Somebody may come along to offer help. Give it time as this board has been very quiet lately.


RedDog

Posts : 30
Join date : 2015-01-30

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Re: ABSOLUTELY NOTHING FOR BEING DEAF

Post by oldandintheway on Fri Dec 18, 2015 9:03 pm

I have severe, chronic tinnitus (I am never without it) which I attribute to firearms training, especially cavalier actions by trainers (discharging blanks right beside your head!) in the 1980's. I was retired with PTSD in 1997 but it has never occurred to me that my tinnitus is also an "injury on duty". Since I can't document it I don't suppose I could prove it. I suspect that you are similarly challenged as your force will always reject a claim that your condition is related to a specific incident or incidents. Mine has a severe effect on my life as, in addition to the distressing constant noise, I can no longer listen to music (a lifelong passion). I feel for you and hope that someone can help. It seems clear that hearing problems can be "duty related" - the problem is in proving it.

oldandintheway

Posts : 27
Join date : 2015-06-12

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Re: ABSOLUTELY NOTHING FOR BEING DEAF

Post by Roger Melly on Sun Jan 31, 2016 10:13 am

You may find the organisation should have kept records and recorded levels of sound.
I spent several years on Traffic as a PC and returned as a SGT. After that ran an intercept team where unprescribed vehicles where fitted with auxiliary warning equipment in a non standard fit. I have lost a more than normal top of my frequency range at 50. I can't hear in a social group situation. I approached one of the many legal firms taking action and they weren't interested. Anyone who was involved in many of the long pursuits or even t-pac training will know the internal sound levels within a vehicle. As will control room operators as the common cry was " I cant hear anything because of the sirens" during a commentary. Out of interest how many former Traffic officers suffer similar or worse symptoms. If we got enough I wonder if Ron Thompson would support a class action.

Roger Melly

Posts : 22
Join date : 2015-01-31

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Re: ABSOLUTELY NOTHING FOR BEING DEAF

Post by Jacks Bro on Sun Jun 19, 2016 4:56 pm

Gents I thought I knew my rights, law graduate, Sgt, passed my Inspector's exams, I did not. Firstly, well done for reaching out both PIPIN and IODPA are excellent organisations. By joining you will realise that you are not alone and that you have a Police family that will help and support you.

I have learnt lots about the law and procedure that govern IOD awards.

Also we have two Police Federation approved Solicitor's who have got some great results. Mark Lake of Catwright King and Ron Thompson if Haven Solicitors. Both are very approachable. I would recommend making contact. There details are :-

http://cartwrightking.co.uk/profile/mark-lake-P84/

http://havensolicitors.co.uk/Contact.aspx

Molly Dog if you are still living around Notts go for Mark Lake as he will travel up and see you. If you struggle with Notts Fed speak to Adam Galley Derbyshire JBB as he has signed the C2 document requesting funding for retired officers from other forces who are struggling to get local fed assistance.

Old and in the way - I would recommend that you speak to either Mark or Ron. It may be a forensic examination of your service record, OH records, and FOI requests may reveal pertinent information as well as an assesment from a Consultant, for all you know the force may have settled claims relating to injuries stemming from the cavalier attitude to firearms.

Please keep us posted and I wil help if I can.


Jacks Bro

Posts : 11
Join date : 2016-05-05

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Re: ABSOLUTELY NOTHING FOR BEING DEAF

Post by oldandintheway on Mon Jun 20, 2016 8:58 am

Jacks Bro - thanks for your post. I have been to an audiologist. His opinion was that my hearing had deficiencies, especially around 12 khz; that it could have been caused by exposure to firearms, OR to exposure to white noise in my previous career as a computer operator, OR to a number of other causes. At no time in my police career or my previous career was there documentation of any specific incidents considered to be causal. Whilst anyone with "common sense" might associate traumatic hearing exposure with long term problems, the huge hurdle is in actually providing documentary proof especially when specialists can never categorically state that "this condition was caused by this circumstance and no other". Add to that any organisation's tendency to try to pass the buck or deny responsibility and the uphill struggle becomes an attempt to climb Everest.

I gave up any hope of claiming for my tinnitus and hearing loss a long time ago.

oldandintheway

Posts : 27
Join date : 2015-06-12

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Re: ABSOLUTELY NOTHING FOR BEING DEAF

Post by Jacks Bro on Mon Jun 20, 2016 12:43 pm

I don't know the specifics if your case, causation can be a major obstacle which can be overcome by strong medical evidence. I don't know the standing of your audiologist, not all Consultants are equal, has yours got experience of Police officers or firearms more specifically. Have you spoken to Mark or Ron ? If the fed will pay for an expert report it's worth trying, if a second opinion from an eminent practitioner displaces any questions around causation and you overcome that hurdle it may be easier to pursue an IOD.

Jacks Bro

Posts : 11
Join date : 2016-05-05

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Re: ABSOLUTELY NOTHING FOR BEING DEAF

Post by oldandintheway on Mon Jun 20, 2016 7:58 pm

Jacks Bro - I am an IOD penioner (Band 3) due to PTSD - I suffer hearing problems which have never been part of my assessment since my retirement in 1997. Any contact with police and any conflict makes me extremely ill which is why I avoid it, otherwise I would have attempted to get an increase to Band 4 as I have never been able to work since leaving the police. I cope well enough on what I have (so long as they let me keep it!). The person who needs our support is not me but Mollydog for whom it is a primary injury, but thanks for your thoughts.

oldandintheway

Posts : 27
Join date : 2015-06-12

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Re: ABSOLUTELY NOTHING FOR BEING DEAF

Post by Jacks Bro on Mon Jun 20, 2016 8:09 pm

No not at all, we need to stick together others on this forum have helped me and IODPA. I believe in Karama. I'll PM him

Jacks Bro

Posts : 11
Join date : 2016-05-05

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Re: ABSOLUTELY NOTHING FOR BEING DEAF

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